Poll: Should Mazda have taken the Retro design route for the ND MX-5?

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Originally Posted by MiataQuest

If they put it into a Miata, they would probably tune it to 155 hp :frantic:

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BBR have already 155hp~ with a remap on the 1.5L engine, they sell the "starchip" for around £600, damn bargain. That power rivals my built 1.6, mine cost near £4k to get to that level though. The 2.0L can apparently hit 195hp with their cams and a remap.

I wouldn't be surprised if Mazda either up the power output, or decrease the engine size significantly (to a 1.2L/1.3L - or whatever gives them the same output as the current lineup). I feel the latter is more likely given the world of today demanding fuel efficient engines that produce less CO2... Why not abuse the high compression with a smaller engine, best of both worlds

I'll even go as far as saying I wouldn't be surprised if they could pull it off with a little 3 cylinder engine to cut weight off the engine block.

Problem is, if they did, would it want to rev the same? Very few cars in today's market rev up to 7500rpm. Not ones with small price tags anyway

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Apologies on digressing from the OP's topic. Back to NA vs ND looks :D

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Originally Posted by Agent☣Orange

I think Mazda is tone deaf to the American consumer. Being Japan’s smallest car company that could, you would think they’d listen to 20 years of feedback and install the same 360hp motor in the Miata as they did their Speed3s.

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It would only work with an American market though. Lack of power is always the top comment when talking about a Miata, but I've noticed it tends to be the West that it's mostly a problem too. Being in the UK myself, people tend to lean towards Tuner cars rather than Muscle. The Mustang and Camaro are awesome and gorgeous cars, I still haven't driven one to this day. I've chased one over the local mountain during a race event though, 5.0L vs 1.6L. In my environment here anything more than 200hp and I don't see it being used, the roads are too narrow and aren't straight enough to open a big engine up.

You at least have Flyin' Miata for the V8 jobs :winky:

I have heard discussion of tuners decoding the ND ECU and remapping it to around 200bhp, n/a.

I'm ambivalent about the power output of a specialized Miata. I'd kind of like to see it around 300hp, but I also know the car will drive completely different. The V8 swaps are pretty useless, IMO. You're fighting physics to get the power down in a car like this, so driving it looks really boring. I equate it to being on a racetrack in a Dodge Challenger; fast in the straights, dicey in the corners. The few times I've been on track the same time with a V8 Miata, it was a rolling roadblock in the corners.

I have difficulty understanding Mazda's product lineup at times. Since the demise of the RX7, they really don't have halo car. If you look at their hottest performance models in the past 10-3 years, they have been sedans or 5 door wagons. That helps insurance for the US market. Perhaps they don't have the leeway to risk a hot performance Miata on showroom floors when they have such a close relationship with the aftermarket companies? I also wonder if American consumers are too fickle and soft for that. If an RF is around 32k USD, a hot versions would be what? 38-40k? That's a steep price for such a small market. For example, the Mustang Ecoboost starts around $26k and the convertible at $32k. You're going to have a hard time selling more units against a car like that, even though that's not really an apples to apples comparison. The Mustang GT (V8) starts around 35k, and THAT is a lot of car for the money. Maybe Mazda is wiser than us to stay between the lines?

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Originally Posted by kung fu jesus

Maybe Mazda is wiser than us to stay between the lines?

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I suppose it depends on their target audience? Mazda has definitely been putting a lot of effort in over the years to boost sales State-side, but different markets want different things. My home area is littered with hot-hatches and people with an incessant need to have a big-whoosh-turbo (to the extent of if you don't fit that description, you're not a "car guy" here"). It's rare to see purpose built cars on the roads here anymore, like the miata or an elise, I've never actually seen an FD in the flesh either, if I wanted one I'd have to ship it :lol: There's an abudnace of early 00's WRX's and Evo's; they're normally written off by a youngster prety swiftly anyway.

The RX7 was the best car mazda built, and the best car to come out of Japan for me. It had the perfect recipe despite being powered by a rotary, which only elevated the car to another level that other cars couldn't touch. The reception became the gold standard, even nowadays I feel a lot of people would happily buy the RX7 of today's world, if they were still making them. I feel the RX8 was intended to take the crown as Mazda's headline act. The recipe was right, and a lot of the previous rotary's gremlins had been resolved, but it's as if Mazda were trying to sell the RX8 to the same crowd that either wanted the RX7 or for previous owners, who were now at least 10 or 15yrs older and needed something more practical beacause they were 40+ with other commitments :lol:

I understand a car will always be built around a budget, but the Miata and the RX7 acheived very different goals. I remember the notion "The MX5 is the sports car for everyone, the RX7 is the sports car for the engineers who built them", I just can't remember where from :lol:

Mazda seem to be trying to compete with BMW and Audi alot with the Mazda6, it'ss a cpabale beast but not everyone wants a saloon car. I feel Mazda have an ace up their sleeve, maybe it's a new generation of the RX lineup, they've been quiet for awhile with that now, I just hope it's priced sensibly to sell. Unfortunately again though, in today's market I can't see reliable, well built sports cars being sold for acceptable prices. The world has got too constringent on emissions and fuel economy, hence why cars with solid power cost, and swapping in an aftermarket part can net such a power bump now. Cars aren't weak, they're just choked to death to pass regulations.

On a side note, but also relating to an overpowered V8 miata - there's currently a V6 conversion in the works. As in an actual company providing a turn key kit using a 3.0L engine out of the old Jaguar S Type, cost is currently around 6-7k all in, you just need a donor car. The engine from there could easily be tuned to get near the 300hp mark, it'd be a lot of work though. :shrug:

Mazda has been marketing their fuel economy and driving experience here until recently. Now they are promoting their design and quality perception. I won’t argue that emissions requirements are higher, but the engineering and tech is catching up. Today’s vehicles are making amazing power and economy.

The only way I see Mazda reviving the rotary is in a hybrid platform, which makes sense for that application. If the rx7 comes back, I would expect it to be a similar formula as an NSX or McLaren, but that’s a tough sell unless the pricing is right.

On another side note, that Jag engine is garbage. I would definitely be in for the GM LFx swap. Those V6s are lovely and the power and delivery is a far better match for the chassis than a LSx swap (IMHO). :)

As an NA owner I think the ND is a great 21st century update. There are some aspects of it styling that could be tweaked in my opinion but nothing significant. Overall Mazda can be proud of it.

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Originally Posted by kung fu jesus

The only way I see Mazda reviving the rotary is in a hybrid platform, which makes sense for that application. If the rx7 comes back, I would expect it to be a similar formula as an NSX or McLaren, but that’s a tough sell unless the pricing is right.

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The NSX was executed completely wrong in my eyes, 165k for a Honda powered by a twin-turbo V6 is scandalous. Considering you could have a GTR for under 40k now, I don't see why anyone would buy one.

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Originally Posted by lucmor444

As an NA owner I think the ND is a great 21st century update. There are some aspects of it styling that could be tweaked in my opinion but nothing significant. Overall Mazda can be proud of it.

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I love the NA (mostly because I own one), but I imagine the ND probably fulfils Mazda's vision on the "perfect roadster" better than any other model, and without a doubt drives better too