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View Full Version : help creating a bov'd s/c setup please.



imperfekt
01-04-2012, 01:12 PM
this is what i want.


http://youtu.be/aWVFv3pGR5Y

he says it's the m45 (jrsc) with an ebay BOV... i'll be purchasing my jrsc soon, but my knowledge and research about sc's makes me wonder how this sound effect is accomplished... the beautiful whine of a super, with the blow off of a turbo :S

any engine savvy people who can school me are welcomed to do so :)

imperfekt
01-04-2012, 01:13 PM
if the vid embed doesn't work... it's

http://youtu.be/aWVFv3pGR5Y

Caoboy
01-04-2012, 07:09 PM
I cant watch the video at work, but PM gunwoo over on CR.net.

cjsafski
01-04-2012, 07:34 PM
Lol that is my car. Mechanically it is pretty simple to do. Put the throttle body back in the stock location and use a knock off greddy bov. Hook up the normal port on the bov to manifold and the secondary to one of the charge pipes. Also the vaccum line that goes to the canister on the sc needs to be moved from the blower to the intake mani. However the next part may be an issue for you. Unless you want your car to run like crap, you need to run a standalone since the bovs vent a lot of air at all times. I actually moved to a dual throttle setup and no longer have the car set up like this.

imperfekt
01-04-2012, 08:41 PM
ty ty i <33333333 your car.

imperfekt
01-04-2012, 08:45 PM
sooooo... the powercard won't work? =\ ...megasquirt here i come :P every time i watch that vid i go :)

imperfekt
01-04-2012, 09:06 PM
unfortunately i'm not very mechanically inclined...

755

i can't tell what you mean by the normal and secondary ports on the bov.. i only see one vacuum port (number 1 on the diagram)... should the flange be attached/welded to the intake manifold or installed between the tb and manifold? and the bypass valve/canister attached to the sc, you mean to attach that to the manifold instead of the charger?

thanks again :)

madufaku
01-05-2012, 03:41 PM
I would recommend keeping the car naturally aspirated if you aren't very mechanical. Mega squirt can be a huge pain in the dick if you don't know what you're doing.

adamvanxxx
01-05-2012, 03:56 PM
Cjsafski, why did you decide to swap the positions of the TBs?

imperfekt
01-05-2012, 08:14 PM
well, simply put, if i leave it stock then i'll never learn! :)

cjsafski
01-06-2012, 02:17 PM
Cjsafski, why did you decide to swap the positions of the TBs?

I was having a hard time getting the car to idle right with an air to air intercooler. If the TB is in the stock location with an intercooler the idle valve is very slow to compensate for the large throttled volume. Also throttle response went up a lot when I made the switch. The car was originally built for autox so it was a nice mod for that.

Guitarjon
01-06-2012, 06:42 PM
When adding an intercooler to a supercharger set up you will experience a bad idle (idle droop) because of the lack of air volume in the pipe work. Obviously when you charge the car the throttle body is moved giving a huge path for the air to get from the idle air valve right to the inlet manifold. If you think the car is at a stand still and the gas peddle is not opening the air then it hunts and almost stalls the engine from lack of air.

Because the supercharger kit has a bypass valve it does not need a bov in the standard set up. However, if you decide you want to intercool the set up or gain more throttle response you need to add a second throttle body. Here in the uk we call the a dual throttle body kit. It basically works by putting the throttle body in its standard position and having the throttle body before the supercharger open a tiny bit to allow air to always be in the system. Now you have air in the system all the time if the throttle body on the inlet position suddenly closes when you let off the gas then the air has no where to go other than back through the charger bypass which it can't do so ideally you need to install a bov somewhere between the two throttle bodies between the inlet throttle body and the supercharger. I did mine on the pipe between the outlet of my intercooler and the inlet throttle body.

Apologies if you already know all of this, just trying to help out. There are some people who say that a bov is not needed on a supercharger set up even with dual throttle bodies but many would agree that it helps the system. I was getting awful belt squeal from charger stalling prior to putting and setting up my throttle body.

It's also worth noting that on a small charger output like the m45 that you will be better with a bov with a weaker valve system as most bov on the market are geared up for higher output turbo chargers with more psi. Some bov won't always work on low pressure systems eg 5psi.

Agent☣Orange
01-06-2012, 07:14 PM
Great info jon, thank you! I've followed along Nutz a long time, even when that one guy was making pulley kits for sale. Then there's someone else named GodlessCommie who did I nice dual TB setup as well.

I'm still on the fence between an IC or water/meth injection but the dual TB is one of my favorite projects.

Guitarjon
01-06-2012, 07:55 PM
Yeah I met up with one of the guys who started selling the kid. PJB on mx5 nutz he was called. In fact he was kind enough to install it and set it up for me and help me with my intercooler. I have modified cars in the past but the NA was my first FI project. I learnt a lot. Mainly that aftermarket ecus are hard work lol.

I know another forum member who runs a water/ meth injection and a charge cooler set up instead of an air/air intercooler very successfully. He's running about 10 psi of boost and it's making a lot of power for an m45. It's running on the limit but his cooling seems to be adequate. I went for the intercooler as it was easy to install and more easily available at a lower cost. Setting up dal throttle bodies was hard work though as you need to get hem balanced right or you get some horrible noises.

Some People hate the noise of bovs but personally I love em!

imperfekt
01-06-2012, 10:09 PM
woo :) that's a bit of information to take in... :) i wrote a guy named braineack about his custom-built megasquirt ecu's who informed me that i could just keep the jrsc powercard and i'd just need to move the ait as close to the tb as possible?

imperfekt
01-07-2012, 12:48 AM
edit: i can keep the jrsc powercard but only if i don't run an intercooler, as the volume of air would be much less...


woo :) that's a bit of information to take in... :) i wrote a guy named braineack about his custom-built megasquirt ecu's who informed me that i could just keep the jrsc powercard and i'd just need to move the ait as close to the tb as possible?

Guitarjon
01-07-2012, 05:57 AM
Brianeak is a mod over on miata turbo and certainly knows his stuff about all things charged and ecus. I don't know enough to help you ou with power cards as I ran a afpr and reduced the base timing until I got my my megasquirt up and running.

I installed the intercooler with the afpr and reduced base timing which ultimately just made me slower but it was fine to run. So I guess the power cards are just a better version of an afpr as they add fuel under boost and do your power cards reduce timing too?

Guitarjon
01-07-2012, 06:04 AM
Your talking about AITs. Do you actually air inlet temperature sensors? You would only need one of these if you are getting rid of your afm/ maf and are running something such as megasquirt to control timing based on air temperature. You dont need to run an air to run an intercooler but further down the line it would help as it would tell the ecu what air temperature was going into your engine and with an intercooler it will be cooler air hopefully.

imperfekt
01-07-2012, 09:02 PM
tbh, i like the output of the 1.8 as is... while the power gained from the sc is definitely a bonus, it's not the reason i want to get it. I want to drive around sounding B.A. like the video. :P

...because not-racecar

Guitarjon
01-08-2012, 01:06 PM
So are you wanting to add an intercooler or anything or just want to put a BOV in?

brontosaurus
01-08-2012, 01:09 PM
Cjsafski, why did you decide to swap the positions of the TBs?
There's a huge thread on m.net about this. Pretty much you're running the blower unthrottled the whole time. You can also run dual throttles for more benefits.

adamvanxxx
01-08-2012, 01:12 PM
There's a huge thread on m.net about this. Pretty much you're running the blower unthrottled the whole time. You can also run dual throttles for more benefits.

I ended up finding some info on it, I don't need the info it just intrigued me.

imperfekt
01-08-2012, 01:25 PM
no intercooler. my buddy says it's not necessary for 5psi...

Guitarjon
01-08-2012, 01:27 PM
If your just wanting to install a BOV then you may be disapointed without the dual throttle bodies because there won't be any positive charged air inside the tubes when the throttle closes. Or if there is it will be minimal as the bypass valve does the work.

imperfekt
01-08-2012, 01:29 PM
i read that thread, and with the guy who has his setup like this: 1076 1077

his bov is welded onto the blower outlet? hmmm, i wonder if it has any sound to it like cja's video...

There's a huge thread on m.net about this. Pretty much you're running the blower unthrottled the whole time. You can also run dual throttles for more benefits.

imperfekt
01-08-2012, 01:38 PM
straight from the horses mouth...

Lol that is my car. Mechanically it is pretty simple to do. Put the throttle body back in the stock location and use a knock off greddy bov. Hook up the normal port on the bov to manifold and the secondary to one of the charge pipes. Also the vaccum line that goes to the canister on the sc needs to be moved from the blower to the intake mani. However the next part may be an issue for you. Unless you want your car to run like crap, you need to run a standalone since the bovs vent a lot of air at all times. I actually moved to a dual throttle setup and no longer have the car set up like this.

it doesn't sound super difficult. i just wanted to clarify the terminology meaning: can i make the assumptions that the "normal port" is the bottom flange and the "secondary" is the vacuum hose outlet. the "charge pipe" is the crossover pipe between the blower and the tb, and the "canister" is the bypass valve on the supercharger housing...?

VdizzleMyNizzle
01-13-2012, 02:15 AM
Sounds like alot of work just to put a BOV. I'm planning on running my supercharger kit as is. The whinning sound is good enough.

imperfekt
01-27-2012, 12:12 AM
If your just wanting to install a BOV then you may be disapointed without the dual throttle bodies because there won't be any positive charged air inside the tubes when the throttle closes. Or if there is it will be minimal as the bypass valve does the work.

this just hit me (weeks later...) that you mean to assume I'll be following the installation instructions and moving the tb to a position ahead of the charger?

neh, i think i have to leave the tb in the stock location (attached to the intake manifold), find somewhere to put the bov in the cross bar between the charger and tb (no intercooler), and there will be nothing but a filter between the air and the charger's intake. ...basically, i want to treat the super like it's a belt-driven turbo: air will go into it, air will get pressurized between the blower and the tb/intake mani., and when the tb shuts, the bov will release excess pressure....

am i failing to understand something? :(

JakeLS01
02-07-2012, 09:08 PM
When you are all mentioning dual throttle bodies, are we talking two fully functional bodies? Or one functional (in stock location on intake manifold) and one "dummy" on the supercharger? Trying to understand all of this as I'm wanting to do a dual throttle body setup. However, all I get on other forums in dumb remarks to my question. Maybe y'all can be of better assistance. :lol:

Agent☣Orange
02-07-2012, 09:16 PM
It's a fair question and you're not going to be rediculed here. Yes, dual throttle bodies refers to two actual throttle bodies adjusted to work together via a custom cable setup, no dummy TB involved.

It's been discussed a lot on MX5nutz as well as a great writeup from a guy named GodlessCommie on another forum.

JakeLS01
02-07-2012, 09:48 PM
It's a fair question and you're not going to be rediculed here. Yes, dual throttle bodies refers to two actual throttle bodies adjusted to work together via a custom cable setup, no dummy TB involved.

It's been discussed a lot on MX5nutz as well as a great writeup from a guy named GodlessCommie on another forum.

Thanks for the reply, Yata, rep'd. I guess I'll find that writeup and do some more researching. I'm currently running a TDR air-to-air intercooler and from what I know, dual TB's would benefit me in the long run.

imperfekt
02-08-2012, 01:07 AM
i read that the dual throttle body setup was one tb set to be always partially open, but the second one in line is the actual fully functional one...

but idk and i've never tried it...

butttttt.... i bought my jrsc m45 two days ago, waiting for it to ship! c'mon gomiata! what's takin em so longgggggg?? :P

JakeLS01
02-08-2012, 04:19 PM
i read that the dual throttle body setup was one tb set to be always partially open, but the second one in line is the actual fully functional one...

but idk and i've never tried it...

butttttt.... i bought my jrsc m45 two days ago, waiting for it to ship! c'mon gomiata! what's takin em so longgggggg?? :P

From what I understand, one throttle body is partially open all the time while the other ("stock") is normally functional. Then as the "stock" one opens, the partially opened one opens more so.

imperfekt
02-08-2012, 06:41 PM
so i called gomiata today... turns out they DON'T have any m45 chargers, and they can't get any, so i'm outta luck there... they tried to sell me the mp62 for an extra 600 but i opted for the refund instead -.- i'm pretty unhappy after saving all winter for it

Agent☣Orange
02-08-2012, 07:17 PM
They're always popping up for sale. You can get a nice setup complete with fuel management for $1500 in new condition or an old Sebring version for half that price. It's usually considered an entry level FI because people usually step up to an FFS, MP62 or turbo afterward and then sell their nice M45 systems for a good price.

imperfekt
02-08-2012, 09:29 PM
cool, i'm just apprehensive to post the WTB thread.


They're always popping up for sale. You can get a nice setup complete with fuel management for $1500 in new condition or an old Sebring version for half that price. It's usually considered an entry level FI because people usually step up to an FFS, MP62 or turbo afterward and then sell their nice M45 systems for a good price.

JakeLS01
02-08-2012, 10:12 PM
cool, i'm just apprehensive to post the WTB thread.

Then just got MP62, you won't regret it. :-P

imperfekt
02-18-2012, 01:24 AM
So, I was calling around and though there were no m45's in new condition, I managed to snag a recently rebuilt m45 from track dog racing for 1600... hope this one doesn't fall through ((crosses fingers))

I hear they're pretty cool people over there at tdr :)