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Thread: Looking at new tires

  1. #1
    Ninja Messiah kung fu jesus's Avatar
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    Looking at new tires

    I'm researching and shopping new tires for my dual-use car. I have one set of tires and wheels. I do 4-6 HPDEs/year and this is my cheap DD/toy car. I only do one set of tires and wheels for a variety of reasons; simplicity, learning tool, apples-to-apples self-education. Frankly, as a staff member and instructor at HPDEs, I don't have a lot of time to swap tires, brakes, and rotors around at the events. It may seem like a compromise, but I look at at it as translating my track time to street driving because I'm using the same brakes and tires I use everyday. It also helps me keep things "real" as wanting to return home at the end of the day intact.

    I have used a lot of different "extreme" performance tires over the years. They are usually "200 treadwear" tires. Awesome grip, but I've found them a bit dicey on the street in wet conditions, needing a lot more attention and margin to keep safe in traffic. For this, I was looking at "Max performance tires", with usually have a higher tread wear rating and fare a bit better in the rain, though sacrificing at overall grip. I am shopping a 205/50-15.

    I was looking at various sites, reading a lot of reviews, narrowing my choices and budget. I noticed something while reading test results on the Tirerack site. They tested both categories last year, on the same car, same tire size, about two weeks apart. That's some valuable apples-to-apples comparisons. I took a little time to take their test graphs from both categories and placed them side by side. It's really interesting to me. It helps me to determine a bit of value for my concerns and compromise.


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    Ninja Messiah kung fu jesus's Avatar
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    Something interesting to note, the pricing on all the tires that are available in my size ranges from $87 - 150 ea. The Contis are the lowest priced, their latest model dropped last year. The Michelin tires are not available in my size. The Extreme tires are, sans the RS4 (195 or 225, not 205).

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    Super Moderator tsingson's Avatar
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    I am running the Nitto NeoGens on mine. Works great in the rain and regular street driving. Haven't pushed them real hard though. Price point was really good at Discount Tire.

    https://www.discounttire.com/buy-tir...eo-gen/p/40306

    Not sure how well this would work for you though.

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  6. #4
    5,000 rpm - there be torque here! MiataQuest's Avatar
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    Hello Steven,
    Your experience is more rich than mine...
    For my car I was considering these tires to do it all, what do you think?
    BF Goodrich G-FORCE RIVAL S 1.5 - SIZE: 205/50R15
    $133 at Tire rack.
    ==================
    The g-Force Rival S 1.5 is BFGoodrich's Extreme Performance Summer tire developed for sports car, performance sedan and sports coupe driving enthusiasts who want their tires tuned to lower their run times in solo, autocross, time attack and hill climb events. The g-Force Rival S 1.5 is designed to raise the limits by delivering extreme grip that's extremely predictable, with improved handling response over its predecessor. However, like all Extreme Performance Summer tires, it is not intended to be serviced, stored nor driven in near- and below-freezing temperatures, through snow or on ice.

    A further evolution of the BFGoodrich Rival S, the Rival S 1.5 features an updated construction process aimed at increasing the steering precision and transitional response often demanded by the drivers of smaller, lighter vehicles. The Rival S 1.5 features the same tread compound as its predecessor, which is designed to offer maximum dry and improved wet grip, as well as offer quicker warm-up in competition conditions, yet continues to earn a 200 Treadwear rating in Uniform Tire Quality Grade (UTQG) testing. This silica-infused compound is molded into an asymmetric, three-rib tread design. Large, solid outboard tread blocks and BFGoodrich's Extreme Tread Edge (ETE) shoulder design wraps the tread compound farther down the sidewalls for predictable feedback and maximum cornering grip from start to finish. Lateral groove draft angles promote consistent performance and wear, while chamfered block edges resist feathering under extreme cornering and braking.
    =============


    Link: https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...omCompare1=yes

    Tire Rack review & comparison here: https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests...y.jsp?ttid=226
    Last edited by MiataQuest; 02-15-2018 at 10:46 AM.

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    Ninja Messiah kung fu jesus's Avatar
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    Anthony, I've heard great things about the Neogens from other Miata owners, but I've never driven on them. I generally go with something a little more aggressive. I think, though, from those I know with them, they are a terrific option for year-round driving.

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  9. #6
    Ninja Messiah kung fu jesus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiataQuest View Post
    Hello Steven,
    Your experience is more rich than mine...
    For my car I was considering these tires to do it all, what do you think?
    BF Goodrich G-FORCE RIVAL S 1.5 - SIZE: 205/50R15
    $133 at Tire rack.
    ==================

    Link: https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...omCompare1=yes

    Tire Rack review & comparison here: https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests...y.jsp?ttid=226

    I had these on my NA. I tracked those tires A LOT. They are fantastic in the dry, the grip is amazeballs, but turn-in can be a micro-second vague. I found them a little spooky in heavy rain and standing water. It reminded me of the Azenis 615k in that regard. However, unlike the 615k, they handled heat a lot better, but I heat cycled them so much, I did notice they were starting to fall off in overall grip.

    I was considering the Rivals again, but I was leaning towards the RE71R for price and response. Both would wear pretty fast, but I was intrigued that the RE71R tested above the Rivals.

    If you don't drive the car much, you have to consider that these are going to get hard as they age, they will be more sensitive to cold temperatures. They will also be LOUD. When I lived in MI so many yeas ago, I would take the summer wheels and tires off my Miata, bag them and store them in my heated basement, laying flat. The car was kept on jackstands over the winter or on junk tires/wheels.

    I probably make too much of an issue of driving in the rain, but we do get a bit of here in Atlanta, and often. Atlanta traffic is pretty aggressive, so I am sort of used to 70+ with somebody tailgating at speed. What I don't like is hitting standing water and having the car get loose or vague, so I tend to think more about the majority of the mileage I put on this car. Maybe I will go back to two sets of wheels and tire in the future, but for now I want to stick with one until I am more familiar with the car and how it reacts.

    An acquaintance of mine modified his Miata a lot before an event at Road Atlanta. It's a track he knew well, but the changes he made to the suspension surprised him and he wound up putting it in the wall. If I was still in my NA, I would probably be reaching for an RE71R or Rival, maybe one of the others, like the VR-1 or StarSpec 3, etc. I'm easing into this car to avoid mistakes like these:

    Last edited by kung fu jesus; 02-15-2018 at 11:24 AM.

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  11. #7
    6,000 rpm - mere mortals would shift HarryB's Avatar
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    I'm currently on a set of Federal 595RSR's (205/50/15 as well). Was not expecting much out of them, was pleasantly surprised. Very stiff sidewall, easy to get them to operating temps, and they grip very well when warm. Wet grip was also a surprise, if they are not stone cold they handle way better and waaay more predictable than my old Pirelli PZero Nero GTs. Wet grip (for a semi-slick tire) is why I am still considering them against Advans AD08R.

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    Ninja Messiah kung fu jesus's Avatar
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    The 595 RSR and RSR-R are here as well. The price is tempting, but not as a dual purpose tire. Not to me, though others may think differently.

  14. #9
    3,000 rpm - starting to feel the power Pyr0monk3y's Avatar
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    If you can find Hankook RS4's in 195, they might work on 15x7's. They run a bit wide in 245, perhaps the 195s are really 205?

    They last hilariously long and they do pretty good in the wet. They seem to be a fantastic investment if you do a lot of track time.

    My Experience:
    Brand new RS4's 245/45/15 were installed on an E30 at 2am during a 24 hour race last August:



    They ran from 2am-noon. It stopped raining at about 6am. We were the fastest in the rain by about 5 seconds.

    In December they ran two 7 hour races in the dry. (Won the 2nd 7 hour race at VIR.)

    Two weeks ago, those same tires ran a 14 hour dry race at Road Atlanta (and won).

    Thats 38 hours of racing (and two wins!) on one set of tires.

    We plan on running a 12 hour race at VIR in a couple of weeks on the same tires too (if its dry, tread depth is getting low). They are hardening up, but not greasy like RT615k's were for some.
    Quote Originally Posted by tsingson View Post
    What the hell are you thinking Andy?
    1991 Track Rat
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    Function>Everything


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    Ninja Messiah kung fu jesus's Avatar
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    I looked at the RS4 specs. The 195/50-15s have a tread width similar to many 205-50 tires. I had RS2 or RS3s about 8-9 years ago in 225-45-15 I used for the track. They were pretty good, but I never drove them in the rain.

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    Ninja Messiah kung fu jesus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HarryB View Post
    Wet grip (for a semi-slick tire) is why I am still considering them against Advans AD08R.
    I ran around SOCAL in 14” A032Rs for a few years on my Watanabes. Awesome 99% of the time, the 1% that it rained...fuuuuuuuuu, scary stuff. I remember hydroplaning on the 57 around Diamond Bar one night on my way to KINOD at 45 mph. No bueno.

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  19. #12
    4,000 rpm - entering the fun zone Slampen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kung fu jesus View Post
    The 595 RSR and RSR-R are here as well. The price is tempting, but not as a dual purpose tire
    Just curious why?

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    Ninja Messiah kung fu jesus's Avatar
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    The people I asked say the RSR tends to overheat at the track and the grip gets greasy/fades quickly. The tire is also shite in the rain.

    Atlanta is three things: it’s crowded, hilly, and it rains. Average annually is 50” (127cm). SOCAL in comparison is 15” (38cm). This is my primary car, I really don’t want slip off the road just driving to a client appointment. ;)

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    4,000 rpm - entering the fun zone Slampen's Avatar
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    And you what did you pick?

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    Ninja Messiah kung fu jesus's Avatar
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    The Continental ExtremeContact Sports.

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